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| נשלח ב-21/7/2004 23:04 |
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קאנדהר תיבה אישית וכל השמות נרדפים
די וואסער טעמע איז
היר טא סטעי
עס וועט נאך בלייבען אין ווערן באשריבען מיט טינט באלד מער פין וואסער לזכרון ולדראון עולם דעם אומבאלופעטער אין כעלעמער(עקספיריענס)אין רשעות זיי האבן אנגעצינדען דעם אנטיסעמיטיזים אינעם גאנצען ארומיגען געגענט(דאס זענען זייערע רעזאלטאטען)מיט זייער עגאיסטישען אין הערצעל ציוניסטישען פאליטיק פין זיך ארום שפילען אין מאכן ליצינות אין ארויסנעמען זייערע אויגן
וואס צו גארנישט געפירט אויסער צו שפייזען די מויל פין די אנטיסעמיטען אין שאדן געמאכט פאר יארן וואס עס וועט נעמען צו פארעכטען דעם דעמעדזש וואס כעלעמער רשעותגידער סעגדין ענג קאמפ האבן אנגעמאכט פאר אידישע קינדער
הרב ר פנחס יאקאבאויטש ה עמך גבור חיל וואס שטייט אויפן פראנט מיט די הילף פין טויזענטער אידען פין קרית יואל
אין מקדש שם שמים געווען היינט אין זיך בריש גלי אפגעשאקלעט פינעם התגרות באומות וואס די עקספיריענס אין רעזאלטאען פארטיי האט פראקטצירט אויף א שרעקליכען אין אום פאראנווארטליכען מהלך וואס האט געפלאצט אויף
אלע אומשילדיגע קרית יואלע אידן
דער טעמע וועט נישט אזוי שנעל ארפגיין
תוקן על ידי - ekstein - 21/07/2004 23:06:10
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| נשלח ב-22/7/2004 00:15 |
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וויאזוי פלעגט סענדער דייטש זאגן:
סאטמאר פארמאגט צוויי סעמפלס:
א סעמפל פון א קלוגן פוילישן יוד
א סעמפל פון א נארישן אונגארישן יוד:
דער פוילישער חכם איז ר' משה טארים.
דער אונגארישער נאר איז ר' ליפא פרידמאן.
גדלי' סעגעדין איז דער אונגארישער נאר... און אויפ'ן בענקעלע ביז ווען ער וועט וועלן.
דייער מייטש, פנחס יאקאבאוויטש, מענדל שווימער און YUDEL KHAN זענען פוילישע חכמים... און קענען שרייבן בריוועלעך צום רעקארד.
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| נשלח ב-25/7/2004 07:53 |
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די שכינים ארום קרית יאל רוען נישט איין אלעס אדאנק דעם הערצעל ציוניסטישען פאליטיק וואס ווערט פראקטיצירט
אפילו זיידמאן וואס האט שוין געקענט באשטיין אויפן וואסער פארעיקט אז טאמער דער קאנטי אין נישט קרית יואל פירט עס אן אז זייער אפסעט פינעם וועג וואס די אומבאלופערטע סעגעדין אדעמיניסטראציע באהאנדעלט עס
פינעם קארט קוקט אויס וועלען די גוים האבן שוואכע זאכן
אין דאס ווייזט שוין אויפדעם אז עס וועט אי"ה גיין דורך די קאונטי לאמיר נאר האפען אז די חסידישע ציונים זאלען נישט פארדארבן
לא ירעו ולא ישחיתו בעל הר קדשי וישם לך שלום
July 24, 2004
Court battle possible in KJ pipeline war
By Chris McKenna
Times Herald-Record
[email protected]
Goshen – Several Orange County lawmakers hoping to stop Kiryas Joel's proposed water pipeline have raised the possibility of taking court action to challenge how the village conducted the environmental review of its unpopular project.
Talks are preliminary but signal that legislators who persuaded their colleagues to pass a resolution condemning the project on July 1 now want to take action that could disrupt Kiryas Joel's plans.
"We're looking at all the avenues – anything and everything," said Legislator Frank Fornario, a Blooming Grove Republican who co-sponsored the pipeline resolution that was adopted by a 20-1 vote.
Kiryas Joel officials, who hope to start laying a 13-mile underground pipe to New York City's Catskill Aqueduct next year, clearly believe they met all the technical requirements of the state-mandated environmental review, which they concluded May 4 by adopting a final environmental impact statement.
As if to show legislators they had adhered to state law, village trustees listed steps they took in their environmental review in a recent resolution – their long, angry rebuttal to the county's opposition to the project.
But some county lawmakers – suddenly drawn into what has become a hugely controversial project – are taking a fresh look at the completed environmental review and questioning even one of the very first steps: the village's designation of itself as the "lead agency."
"We should have been the lead agency," Legislature Chairman Alan Seidman said yesterday, citing the project's potential impact on growth and development in the region and the amount of wastewater the county will have to treat.
Asked why the county didn't object when Kiryas Joel made itself the lead agency, Seidman says he never saw the notice.
"I'd like to see the distribution list," Seidman said. "I didn't get one."
Seidman also complained that because of when Kiryas Joel sent the county a draft of its environmental impact statement last year, officials from various departments had only three days to respond to a host of complicated issues.
Village officials couldn't be reached yesterday to respond to that charge.
Kiryas Joel Administrator Gedalye Szegedin said on Thursday that neither the county nor any other agencies – including Blooming Grove and Woodbury, two towns that passed resolutions opposing the pipeline – submitted written responses to the final environmental impact statement.
The county's failure to do so has just become a point of contention.
County Planning Commissioner David Church said yesterday that the county decided it could better address its concerns about its project when Kiryas Joel approached its health and public works departments for crucial permits.
But County Legislator Roxanne Donnery is chastising the administration for failing to put its concerns on the record.
"I am absolutely appalled that David was not told to put something in writing by the county executive," she said.
County Executive Edward Diana was away yesterday and couldn't be reached to respond.
Critics of the project are now poring over details of the review process, asking who was notified and when, to decide if they have enough grist to invalidate it, possibly through a lawsuit.
But they say they're exploring other options, too – whatever they can do to halt the project.
Donnery, a Highland Falls Democrat who sponsored the pipeline resolution with Fornario, vowed: "Frank and I are going to turn over every stone, legal or otherwise. We're not going to stop. We're doing our homework right now."
Officials say a deadline to challenge the environmental review is looming – perhaps on Sept. 10 – although it was unclear yesterday if that was the final date to file a lawsuit or seek an administrative remedy.
What's הטקסט שלך כאן
תוקן על ידי - ekstein - 25/07/2004 8:11:19
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| נשלח ב-25/7/2004 10:43 |
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סטאפ שוין דו משוגענער, פאר דו געסט אונז אלע א נערוון צוזאמענבראך.
קום שוין אויף מיט עפעס פריש. איך האב געווארט היינט צען מינוט אז די אשכול זאל זיך עפענען און איך זאל אנקומען צו פעידזש 7, נאר צו דארפן ווייטער ליינען וועגן הערצל ציוניסטישע פאליטיק און כעלמער סעגעדין.
ווער ס'ווייסט וויאזוי מען זאגט "גענוג" אין עקשטיינ'ס דיקשאנערי זאל מיר פליז זאגן, ווייל דער משוגענער נעמט מיר שוין ארויס פון די כלים און וויפיל איך בעט זיך ביי אים פייפט ער זיך אריין אין מיר.
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| נשלח ב-25/7/2004 17:42 |
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נייע בריווען וועגן די וואסער פראבלעם אים רעגירעם צו פריערדיגען עדיטאריעל פינעם רעקאד
ווי עס וועט אין כמעט יעדען ברייו ארויס געברענגט אז דער אומבאלומפערטעם אין הערצעל ציוניסטישען צוגאנד איז דער גורם פין דעם וואסער פראבלעם
אין פאר דיר זיסקייט זאג איך געב דירדעם זעלבען מעסעדזש ווי פאריגע וואך
קאנדהר תיבה אישית וכל השמות נרדפים
די וואסער טעמע איז
היר טא סטעי
עס וועט נאך בלייבען אין ווערן באשריבען מיט טינט באלד מער פין וואסער לזכרון ולדראון עולם דעם אומבאלופעטער אין כעלעמער(עקספיריענס)אין רשעות זיי האבן אנגעצינדען דעם אנטיסעמיטיזים אינעם גאנצען ארומיגען געגענט(דאס זענען זייערע רעזאלטאטען)מיט זייער עגאיסטישען אין הערצעל ציוניסטישען פאליטיק פין זיך ארום שפילען אין מאכן ליצינות אין ארויסנעמען זייערע אויגן
וואס צו גארנישט געפירט אויסער צו שפייזען די מויל פין די אנטיסעמיטען אין שאדן געמאכט פאר יארן וואס עס וועט נעמען צו פארעכטען דעם דעמעדזש וואס כעלעמער רשעותגידער סעגדין ענג קאמפ האבן אנגעמאכט פאר אידישע קינדער
הרב ר פנחס יאקאבאויטש ה עמך גבור חיל וואס שטייט אויפן פראנט מיט די הילף פין טויזענטער אידען פין קרית יואל
אין מקדש שם שמים געווען היינט אין זיך בריש גלי אפגעשאקלעט פינעם התגרות באומות וואס די עקספיריענס אין רעזאלטאען פארטיי האט פראקטצירט אויף א שרעקליכען אין אום פאראנווארטליכען מהלך וואס האט געפלאצט אויף
אלע אומשילדיגע קרית יואלע אידן
דער טעמע וועט נישט אזוי שנעל ארפגיין
July 25, 2004
Letters to the editor for July 25, 2004
TH-R readers react to Doug and Beth on KJ
Last week, Times Herald-Record columnists Beth Quinn and Doug Cunnigham offered separate opinions on the controversy surrounding a proposal by the Village of Kiryas Joel to contruct a pipeline to tap into the New York City aqueduct. Some reader responses to their columns follow.
* * *
Beth Quinn's opinion that many of the people in Kiryas Joel are good people is accurate. The problem is not the people but the leadership of the village. The people don't even know what is going on, because they have no access to our newspapers, and they don't interact with us. They basically do what the leadership tells them to.
Doug Cunningham, who is obsessed with development and loves planning, good or bad, sees nothing wrong with what the leadership of Kiryas Joel is doing. However, he doesn't live nearby, and his property is in no danger. The problem with this village is not just the growth, but that it wants to grow over its neighbors.
As for 1938, none of us is building gas chambers; the barbed wire was put up by Kiryas Joel. Our problem is the leadership keeps moving that barbed wire outwards.
Valerie Hunter-Bequette
Middletown
* * *
If Mr. Cunningham suspects "there is some anti-Semitism at work" in regard to the KJ issue, then he should take a good look in the mirror. A quote from his recent op-ed: "Alternately, they should stay within Kiryas Joel, abandon all thoughts of growth or movement, and willingly accept the barbed wire the rest of us ever-so-tolerant citizens will string around the outside. November 1938, anyone?"
How dare he put such vile words into the mouths of other citizens to imply they are thinking this way. Many Jews whose relatives died at the hands of Nazis are now seething at Cunningham's implication that their opposition to Kiryas Joel's expansion might be based in anti-Semitism!
Cunningham's foolish assumptions feed the fires of prejudice itself. Focus on the issue: one community's explosive growth and its regional impacts on all communities and the environment.
Don Devine
Chester
* * *
This letter concerns the column written by Beth Quinn July 19 concerning "those" people residing in KJ.
Beth! I've always considered your exceptional writing talents and your sense of common sense a huge asset to the TH-R. But your suggestion to enhance relations between KJ and the surrounding community by throwing a block party is about as ridiculous as snow in August.
There are lifters and leaners in this world, and the leaners have been using the system. Under the guise of religious freedom and laws, and the lack of courage by certain politicians, the people in these surrounding communities have been used and abused.
So, Beth, I suggest you take your macaroni salad and watermelon, throw your own block party and invite "those" people. See how many show up.
John Candito
Highland Mills
* * *
Quinn nearly hits the nail on the head, while Cunningham exemplifies the problem. KJ has a serious public relations problem, and won't be able to make real progress until it admits and addresses that.
To attribute negative reactions to anti-Semitism is an easy way for KJ to resist looking at its own part in this drama, which is that KJ makes it clear as day that it does not consider itself part of the larger community. This is the fundamental insult that the rest of us will never be able to swallow.
We grew up learning that America is a melting pot, where all groups are welcome to work, play and communicate together. Acceptance is a two-way street.
I agree with Beth Quinn that there is still a chance. If KJ residents want to avoid a permanent state of antagonism, they will embrace and educate the community instead of defying it. Make Orange County grateful for your presence and your business.
It's quite possible. And for the rest of the community, let the wounds of the past be in the past, be friendly with your Hasidic neighbors, and vigilantly insist on legislative integrity at all levels. And if government support for large families is your complaint or fear, then contact your representatives.
Warren Sirota
Greenwood Lake
* * *
Regarding Doug Cunningham's column about not scapegoating KJ for planning, the problem is there is no family planning. Their culture is partly formulated on having as many children as possible. It's part of their religious beliefs and they are entitled to it.
The problem is, because of their religious beliefs, non-Hasidic peoples pick up the cost of having as many children as possible. I chose to have only two children because I couldn't afford more. Both my husband and I have worked all our lives and continue to do so.
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't at least 80 percent of the Kiryas Joel population under some form or another of public assistance? I say live and let live, but if my tax dollars are supporting their cultural and religious beliefs in family planning, then there is something wrong here.
Yes, they need water, but where is their responsibility to the remainder of Orange County? If this sounds racist, I truly regret it because I don't consider myself a racist. There has to be a regional solution, not just a Kiryas Joel one. Any self-contained culture can't have it both ways.
We have to learn to live together, not push neighbors away until you need them. This breeds mistrust. We have to do better and that includes Kiryas Joel.
Lydia Negron
Washingtonville
* * *
Regarding Douglas Cunningham's column: He is correct that most people in Orange County should be jealous of the ability of KJ politicians to obtain grants and get others to pay for their lifestyle.
All other comments are from someone who most likely doesn't live near any of the communities that follow the laws followed by KJ. Let's disregard the cowardly anti-Semite label he throws out; that is just a way to remove some weaker people from debating.
We the people of Orange County have rights, too. We have the right to purchase a home within a residential area knowing that zoning will not be changed 10 years later. We have a right to expect our wells to be safe from poaching. We have a right to expect our tax dollars to be spread evenly throughout the county. These truths we hold to be self-evident.
Tom Bryceland
Harriman
* * *
I am Jewish, although the residents of Kiryas Joel would probably call me a goy (non-Jew) because I am not of their particular sect. I am glad not to be living near Monroe with "those people" as neighbors.
The problem is not anti-Semitism, although I don't doubt there is some of that going around. The problem is that the perception, and probably the truth, is that they are takers and not givers.
Beth Quinn's column of July 19 is a good start, but not a solution. Doug Cunningham made some good points in the same issue of the Record. But what is needed is for the KJ community to contribute to the whole community. To be fair. To be cordial. To be honest with those not in KJ.
Carl Silverstein
Monticello
* * *
I'm not sure if I'd go to Beth Quinn's party at Kiryas Joel, but I'd sure like to get one started up here in Sullivan County where things are starting to heat up as the Hasidic community spreads into the western towns. Every day it's, "Did you hear, they want to buy the campgrounds! They bought a building in Hortonville, in Youngsville, in Jeffersonville."
Well, who could blame "them" – it's really beautiful in this neck of the woods. It's just that people around here want neighobrs they know by name, not a collective group known as "those people." A smile, a simple greeting, a head nod – all go a long way, on both sides.
I had a lovely conversation with a Hasidic family in Home Depot yesterday – the first time that had happened in the 30 years I've lived here. I hope to have more.
Lisa Davies
Youngsville
* * *
In the beginning, Kiryas Joel didn't like Monroe's laws, so they incorporated. Now neighbors seeking more control of their own destiny are labeled Nazis?
The short version is KJ is growing so fast it's not unreasonable the local towns fear a loss of autonomy. This may already be too late. It's a great rallying cry for KJ that this village's rights are all-important, while at least half of KJ's residents are denied their rights on religious grounds. Add to this a move to stop payments to the Monroe town library with the rationale "Why should we contribute to something we don't use?" I'm at least a little outraged this town that receives so much public funding would have this complaint. Why is it anti-Semitic that outsiders should feel the same way about their tax money?
Then there's always the constitutionally challenged school district, with the state's highest per-student aid ratio. Don't paint me as someone who's against education, but it's bizarre the public only funds one "private" school – this one. I wonder why there's so much resentment in southern Orange.
Kevin Lee
Monroe
הטקסט שלך כאן
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| נשלח ב-25/7/2004 19:59 |
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עקשטיין
ישר כח פאר האלטען אונז אפ טו דעיט. מיט אלע פראבלעמען וואס פלאגען דעם שטעטל קרית יואל.
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| נשלח ב-26/7/2004 16:36 |
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אויב איז מאכן א שטעטל אנטיסעמיטיזם
האט דער אומבאלומבערפטער הערצעל גאנג פון לייביש לעפקאוויטש בהסכמת רבינו הק' זי"ע נישט געטארט מאכן קיין ווילידזש דעמאלטס.
אויב פייטן פאר די רעכטן איז אנטיסעמטיזם
האט דער אומבאלומבערפטער הערצעל גאנג פון לייביש לעפקאוויטש בהסכמת רבינו הק' זי"ע נישט געטארט הייסן סובפינען טויזענט גויאישע שכנים.
אויב גיין אין קאורט קעגן די רעגירונג איז אנטיסעמטיזם
האט סאטמאר נישט געטארט גיין אין קאורט קעגן די גארבידזש רעסייקלינג פלענט.
אויב איז פארלירן די מעיאר וואלן אנטיסעמטיזם און הערצל פאליטיק
וועלן מיר אי"ה ווייטער אנגיין מיט דעם הערצעל גאנג, און מאכן זיכער בעזהשי"ת אז דער קראנקער מענדל שווימער און YUDEL KHAHN וועלן אי"ה שטענדיג בלייבן אינדרויסן און וועלן קענען JOINEN פנחס יאקאבאוויטש און שיקען בריוועלעך אין די רעדאקציע פון דער רעקארד.
פנחס KEEP IT UP, אינאיינעם מיט EKSTEIN און געזעגענען, שיקטס ווייטער בריוועלעך און קנאקטס אריין אין HYDEPARK ווייל עפעס אנדערש קענט עטס ממילא נישט!
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| נשלח ב-26/7/2004 17:18 |
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EKSTEIN, למעשה, ווי האלט עס מיט די macaroni salad וואס BETH QUINN האט געבעטן
היינט ביינאכט נאכן אויספאסטן קען איך מיטגיין מיט דיר אויספאסטן אויב ס'איז נישט פליישיג.
און אויב ס'איז יא, איז דאך עת לעשות לה' הפרו תורתך און מ'וועט אויך מחזיר זיין די עטרה.
מאך א גרויסע פארשען macaroni salad, ווייל איך בין זיכער אז אסאך פון די שווימער אקטיוויסטן וועלן דארט זיין.
איינער זאגט מיר אז יעקב בער פלאנט אויך אהינצוגיין, סאו קען נאך זיין אז ס'וועט זיין בנשיאות כ"ק מרן אדמו"ר.
אזא קידוש ה'
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| נשלח ב-1/8/2004 18:08 |
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 מצורף קובץ די סעגדין כעלעמער ציוניסטישער קאמפאני גייט ווייטער אן מיטן התגרות באומות מיטן טרומפייטערען אין זיך רייצען מיט די ארומוגע שכינים אט איז דא אן אויסצוג וואס דער כעלעמער סעגדין האט דערקלערט אז די שכינים וועלן נישט באקומען קיין וואסער פין דעם פראעיקט אלץ שטראף פארן זיך קעגן שטעלען
But now that those two neighboring communities have passed resolutions opposing the proposed pipeline, Kiryas Joel assumes they no longer want access to the aqueduct water.
Kiryas Joel – Just how big this community's booming population might grow could come down to a meager 18 inches.
That's the diameter of the pipe Kiryas Joel hopes to snake 13 miles across Orange County to siphon off some of the water coursing toward New York City via the Catskill Aqueduct.
A few inches go a long way with water pipes. And in this case, 18 of them could carry enough water from the Catskills to Kiryas Joel faucets to support a population of at least 67,000 people – more than four times the village's current size, the Sunday Record has calculated with help from the Orange County Water Authority. Reaching that mark would give Kiryas Joel more than twice as many people as any Orange County municipality today.
It's no surprise that the leaders of Kiryas Joel – one of New York's fastest-growing municipalities – expect the village's numbers to keep climbing and would plan a pipe wide enough to supply future generations.
But until now, nobody involved in the escalating debate over the village's water project and population growth has offered any public projections of how many people the pipe could serve years from now if it was operating at full capacity.
Even a conservative estimate of 67,000 will likely rankle critics who feel the Hasidic community is growing too much and has failed to adequately explain the potential environmental consequences of its water project.
Even with Kiryas Joel's rapid growth rate – 5.9 percent a year between 1990 and 2000, according to the village's consultants – the day when its streets of mainly three-story apartment buildings would be home to 67,000 people might seem distant.
But multiply its estimated population of 14,904 in 2002 by 5.9 percent a year – year after year – and you find that Kiryas Joel would pass that threshold by 2029, just 25 years from now.
It's unclear if New York City would allow Kiryas Joel a pipe as wide as 18 inches – or even if the project will go forward as planned, considering the intense opposition it has aroused in Orange County and efforts under way to challenge and derail it.
Indeed, city officials expressed concerns about the pipe size several months ago, when Kiryas Joel was planning an even wider one of 24 inches.
In November, Paul Aggarwal, an engineering supervisor for the city's Department of Environmental Protection – the agency overseeing the vast underground tunnels that carry 1.35 billion gallons of water each day from upstate reservoirs to New York City – questioned at a public hearing why Kiryas Joel wanted a pipe width that can normally accommodate up to 12 million gallons a day.
In response, Kiryas Joel – which in 2002 needed only about one million gallons on average – cut the proposed pipe diameter by a quarter, to 18 inches.
The DEP, which is still reviewing Kiryas Joel's water application, has taken no position on the new size, agency spokesman Ian Michaels said.
"We're waiting for their engineering drawings to see what their alternative would be," he said.
Kiryas Joel Administrator Gedalye Szegedin said the village deliberately picked a pipe much bigger than what its current population needs because it doesn't want to have to dig up roads and replace the pipe if the line is no longer big enough.
See PIPEon page 34
Continued from page 4
Laying a 13-mile pipeline is too disruptive for too many neighbors to do twice, he said. The pipe would be buried under roads in four towns – Monroe, Blooming Grove, Cornwall and New Windsor – to tap the Catskill Aqueduct in the Vails Gate section of New Windsor.
"You want to do it once and for all," he said. "Nobody wants to rip out 13 miles of roadway."
Another factor, he said, was that the electrical bill for pumping water through an 18-inch pipe was less than what it would be for a narrower line.
If the project goes forward, Kiryas Joel could draw as much aqueduct water as its last census population and the average usage in New York City would justify – currently, 1.8 million gallons a day, far more than what it needs on most days.
But that limit could keep rising as its population climbs – if the pipe is wide enough to handle the additional flow.
In fact, Kiryas Joel wouldn't even have to ask: Michaels said that after each census, the DEP uses the new population figures to automatically update the withdrawal limits of each of the 65 or so upstate water systems connected to its aqueducts.
Szegedin resists the notion that the pipe diameter could determine Kiryas Joel's future size.
In his view, the village's population growth is virtually an immutable fact – the result of customs in which couples marry young, settle in the bride's home community and have lots of babies. He insists that pattern will hold true regardless of what happens with the pipeline.
"I don't think that the amount of growth in the community is at all contingent upon the pipe," Szegedin said.
But that argument rings false to Michael Edelstein, president of the environmental watchdog group Orange Environment Inc. He accuses Kiryas Joel of trying to "scam" the DEP by saying its growth is inevitable and denying the project will induce it.
"It's a semantic argument," he said. "You can't have people there if you don't have the resources to support their being there."
And the notion that the pipeline could carry as much as 9 million gallons of water underscores for Edelstein what he and some county officials feel is one of the plan's biggest oversights: its failure to explain how additional wastewater made possible by the project would be treated.
Village officials have written only brief responses to such concerns, simply saying that sewage treatment plants in Kiryas Joel and Harriman might be expanded to handle the gradually increasing flow.
Privately, they seethe at the criticism, saying Kiryas Joel already proved its seriousness on the issue – and bailed the county out of potentially costly lawsuits – by building its own sewer plant after the county's Harriman plant hit capacity.
But Edelstein, whose organization successfully sued the county in 1996 over excessive discharges from the Harriman plant, argues that Kiryas Joel's implied solution might be untenable because the Ramapo River can't handle any more sewage from that facility and the one in Kiryas Joel.
"In my view, we've finished with the Ramapo," he said, "and it's not appropriate to allow further growth until you find some other way to address the issue."
Another question is whether Kiryas Joel has enough room for 67,000 or more residents.
The village is only 1.1 square miles, and building homes at typical density on its remaining land – figures gleaned from the environmental review for the pipeline – could max out Kiryas Joel eight years from now, when the population clears 25,000.
That leaves the community the option of either replacing existing homes with high-rises or expanding its borders to make space for new apartments for all the newlyweds – currently, around 200 couples a year, the village estimates.
As people in neighboring areas are already acutely aware, the latter option could either involve annexing land from outside its borders or incorporating a second village – prospects that opponents are already taking steps to try to prevent.
Project cost
Kiryas Joel now estimates its connection to the Catskill Aqueduct could cost $22.2 million, a substantial drop from the $29 million it last calculated. What changed is that the village no longer plans to extend the pipe closer to Washingtonville than originally thought or install taps that Washingtonville and Blooming Grove could use to draw water on an emergency basis. Factoring in such modifications had raised the projected cost. But now that those two neighboring communities have passed resolutions opposing the proposed pipeline, Kiryas Joel assumes they no longer want access to the aqueduct water.
The village has asked Congress for $20 million to cover much of the cost. While that request is pending, trustees passed a resolution this month authorizing $22.2 million in bonds to pay for the project.
Crunching numbers
Jay Beaumont, executive director of the Orange County Water Authority, went through the following calculations to determine how much water Kiryas Joel's proposed pipeline could carry in one day if the diameter were 18 inches.
First, converting inches into feet and using the formula to calculate the area of a circle, you get a cross-sectional area for the pipe of 1.77 square feet. Then, multiply that number by the speed with which water generally moves through pipes. Beaumont said that rate, assuming average pumping power, is 8 feet per second. You now have 14.16 cubic feet per second.
The next task is to convert that figure into the customary unit for municipal water use: millions of gallons per day. A cubic foot holds 7.48 liquid gallons, and there are 86,400 seconds in a day. Multiply those two numbers by 14.16 and you get more than 9 million gallons of water per day. But to be conservative, cut that number in half to 4.5 million gallons a day, Beaumont advises. Water transmission lines, he says, are usually designed about twice as wide as necessary so they can handle demand surges, like fires.
Now, to determine how many people Kiryas Joel's pipeline could serve, consider that the average daily water demand in Kiryas Joel in 2002 was about 1 million gallons. The Census Bureau estimates the village's population that year was 14,904. That translates to an average daily water demand of 67 gallons per person. Therefore, a pipe capable of carrying 4.5 million gallons a day could comfortably serve more than 67,000 Kiryas Joel residents.
Kiryas Joel Administrator Gedalye Szegedin says the village's consultants calculate the pipe capacity slightly lower: 8 million gallons a day. They haven't estimated how many people that would serve, but 67,000 seems like a reasonable figure, Szegedin says.
הטקסט שלך כאן
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| נשלח ב-1/8/2004 18:33 |
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אנגעצויגענע מצב וואס די ווילידזש כעלעמער אין ציוניסטישער האבן זיך אליין געשאפען מיט זייער ווילדן צוגאנג מיט די ארומוגע שכינים באדראט שוין ליידער די זיכערקייט פין גאנץ קר"י וואס קענען שוין נישט האבן די מימימאלע זיכרעהייטס פין די מאנרא פייער דעפארטמענט (וואס אפילו עס איז שוין דא אין מאנרא די מצילי אש איז מען נאך אלץ זייער שטארק אנגעוויזען אויף די קאפאראמיע אין עקספערטיוו פין אלע ארומיגע פייער סטאנמיעס על כל צרה שלא תבא)
זיי צינדען אן דעם אנטיסעמיטישען פייער אין שטעלען אריין אין סכנה 150000 טויזענט נפשות פאר זייער עגאיסטישער פאליטיק
July 31, 2004
Firefighting contract is on the rocks
By Chris McKenna
Times Herald-Record
[email protected]
Monroe – The village has terminated its long-standing fire contract with neighboring Kiryas Joel after Monroe firefighters raised concerns about how a serious incident recently was handled in Kiryas Joel.
The sudden rift came as the two villages seemed close to an agreement on a new contract and creates uncertainty about fire protection in Kiryas Joel – but no immediate concerns.
Monroe remains on call until Oct. 31, and Kiryas Joel also has its own 4-year-old fire squad to fight fires and respond to accidents and other emergencies.
But what will happen when the Monroe contract ends three months from now is unclear.
Monroe trustees voted unanimously on July 20 to cancel the contract, citing "numerous procedural problems" since Kiryas Joel formed its fire squad and the "inability to come to a safe and satisfactory working relationship."
Monroe fire Chief Jeffrey Mahran said yesterday that his safety concerns got worse on July 14 when two construction workers fell unconscious in a drainage cistern in Kiryas Joel after being overcome by fumes.
A subcontractor and paramedics pulled the workers out with ropes. One recovered that day, but the other is still in a coma.
Mahran said he was upset about how emergency workers handled the incident and sent letters to Monroe Mayor Joseph Mancuso and Orange County Emergency Services Commissioner Walter Koury.
He wouldn't elaborate except to say, "It was not handled in a professional manner."
Kiryas Joel Administrator Gedalye Szegedin said he hadn't heard Mahran's complaints about the July 14 incident and had no idea that contract talks had broken down until Mancuso sent a letter this week.
"We were shocked," he said. "It was completely out of the blue."
He said he and Kiryas Joel Mayor Abraham Wieder spoke to Mancuso yesterday and hope to arrange a meeting with county officials to try to resolve the safety concerns and prepare a new contract with Monroe.
"We definitely want to be good neighbors with Monroe," he said. "They served us well for the last 30 years. I don't think it would serve anyone's interest to sever the relationship now."
Kiryas Joel had been hoping to keep Monroe on contract to answer calls on Saturdays and religious holidays, when its Hasidic firefighters cannot work unless lives are at stake. They would also hire Monroe to fight interior fires, which its own squad isn't qualified to do.
Mancuso couldn't be reached for comment yesterday.
הטקסט שלך כאן
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| נשלח ב-2/8/2004 19:24 |
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עקשטיין שרייבט
ריכטיגע פירערשאפט מעכטיגער אפקלאנג
Letters to the editor for August 2, 2004
Let's work with KJ
For years, our elected leaders have behaved like eunuchs by failing to take a proactive approach to solving critical water shortages in southeastern Orange County. Instead they prefer to blame KJ for causing all the problems. KJ took a proactive approach to solving its water shortage problem and our officials and neighboring communities sabotage the pipeline solution.
My supervisor, Mr. Bohan, is an embarrassment. What has been his contribution to solving the problem? Instead, in thinly veiled bigotry, Bohan blasts the so-far successful attempts KJ leadership has provided for the KJ community. Bohan apparently didn't apply for federal funding or request pipeline access to the NYC water as had the City of Newburgh, the Town of New Windsor or Cornwall-on-Hudson. And, as far as I know, neither has Monroe nor Orange County. What's wrong with our leadership?
I applaud the Kiryas Joel Alliance and specifically the "My View" letter of Mr. Pincus Jakobowitz. Jakobowitz doesn't blame anyone for the problem. He notes, "The more (KJ) grows, the more self-containment provisions it ought to implement for the consideration of its neighbors; a pipeline would do just that."
Jakobowitz is showing responsible leadership, stating the problem for what it is and seeking to build bridges with communities, not building walls. I say, let's tear down those walls. Let's follow his leadership model. Let's apply for NYC water access and federal and state funding. Let's solve this problem and refuse to react with bigotry that is undermining a viable solution. Our elected leaders should be part of the solution, not the problem.
Jan Weiner
Blooming Grove
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| נשלח ב-2/8/2004 20:15 |
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קוק'ס אן דעם באמאכטן פיניע יאקאבאוויטש
ער לייגט זיך אליין אריין בריוועלעך אין רעקארד, און שרייבט א נאמען פון איינעם JAN WEINER... פון BLOOMING GROVE
רבותי: אין גאנץ בלומינג גראוו, זיפ קאוד 10914, איז נישטא קיין ווינער און נישט קיין וויינער...
קוקט'ס אן וואס די WHITE PAGES אדער YAHOO טרעפט:
האט עטס די אויסגעשפילטע בלאפערס ביי די מעשה!
נעקסט טיים זוך א נאמען WEISS אדער ROTH אין בלומינג גראוו וועט עטס טרעפן מערערע....
הרוצה לשקר ירחיק עדותו!
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| נשלח ב-2/8/2004 20:18 |
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וויאזוי גייט נאר דיין שפריך ווארט?
פלוץ יפלצון...
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| נשלח ב-2/8/2004 20:40 |
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קאנדהר איך האב געטראפען א -וויינער -אין בלומענגראוו אין
יעצט -וויין -נישט אינגעלע
ווען דער פייער ברענט(וואס די חסידישע ציונים אין קרית יואל האבן אנגעצינדען מיט זייער ציוניסטישע פאליטיק)איז שוין צו שפעט צו- וויינען-
Weiner, Elliot
2838 St Route 94
BLOOMING GROVE, NY 10914
גיי אריין אין דעם לינק אין לייג אריין דעם נאמעןWeiner
ביים לעצטען נאמען אין ביי זיפ קאוד10914 אין רוק אריין ביי סטיעט ניו יארק וועט דיר ארויס קומען די רעזאלט
קריס קען גאנץ אראנדזש קאנטי אויף זיינע פינגער....
http://www.anywho.com/qry/wp_fap
פלץ יפלצון פין הרב ר פנחס יאקאבאוויטש שליט"א וואס איז א ריכטיגער פירער
לשנה הבאה בירושלים....
תוקן על ידי - ekstein - 02/08/2004 20:52:47
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| נשלח ב-2/8/2004 20:54 |
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פיניעלע יאקבאוויטש איז זעט אויס א קאזען מיט דעם צווייטן שווינדלער וויקטאר יאקאבאוויטש (אביגדור)
ביידע קענען נאר שווינדלען.
און ביידע שטייען אייניג אין דער אדמה י"ט אמות למטה...
געזעגענען, האסט גוטע פרענדס (!)
בלייב מיט זיי.
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